[#18011] Anders Mortensen - Håkestad Østre 1715-1722

[Gjest Jeff Erickson]

Continued from [16245]Jeff Erickson, Adelaide, South Australia, 03.11.2003 12:50 (97) Anders Mortensen lived at HÅKESTÅD ØSTRE in Tjolling from 1715 till his death in 1722. Where was he before 1715?.Sandar? He married Ellen Frantzdtr. There were 4 children Maren, Berte, Marte ca1702, Karen ca 1708. Where were they born?Kristian Hunskaar, Hedrum/Oslo, 03.11.2003 15:31 (98) The only Anders Mortensen, who may be the one you are looking for, in Sandar, Tjølling, Hedrum, Brunlanes and Tjøme in 1701 is this one at Bukkeli farm, Tjøme (listed twice): Lenke However, he may have come from another parish or from one of the towns. Jeff Erickson, Adelaide, South Australia, 03.11.2003 21:06 (99) Thank you Kristian. Is there a bygdebok for Sandar. Does it show how long he was at Bukkeli. He didn't seem to move to Håkeståd Østre until 1715 although there are some records that show him dead at 1708. 1657 seems to be the right birth year.Kristian Hunskaar, Hedrum/Oslo, 03.11.2003 21:38 (100) Bukkeli will be in the Tjøme bygdebok. This book has been missing (!) from the National Archive Library for two years, but perhaps someone else has access to the book? Tjøme was a subparish of Nøtterøy in those years. This link shows baptisms in Nøtterøy and Tjøme 1686-1738 Lenke but I can't see that any Anders at Bukkeli has children baptised. By the way, a useful link which shows bygdebooks from Vestfold: http://www.vestfold-slekt.net/bygdebok.html Ketil Firing Hanssen, Bærum, 05.11.2003 12:20 (101) There were actually two brothers, both named Anders Mortensen, at the Bukkeli farm around 1700. The elder died 1708 at age 51, the younger died in 1738 at age 77. In 1701 they are listed as 44 and 41 years old.Kristian Hunskaar, Hedrum/Oslo, 05.11.2003 19:02 (102) I experienced the same as Ketil as I found the Tjøme bygdebook at the University Library today. None of these can be the person we are looking for. As a result, we are back to zero, and out of candidates. Anders Mortensen and his wife are likely to have moved in from outside Larvik county, from which we have the 1701-male-census.

[Gjest Jeff Erickson]

The Tjølling bygdebok p.527 shows Anders Mortensen as 'visstrok fra Sandar' . What does this mean? It also shows daughter Karen 'f ca 1708 var i Hed ved farens dod' Does this mean that Karen was born after her fathers death? Could it be that the brother who died in 1708 was Karens father and the other brother farmed at Håkestad Østre from 1715 -1722. Or is there another Anders Mortensen who was in Sandar and Hedreum at this time

[Gjest Kristian Hunskaar]

'Visstnok fra Sandar' - the author has reason to believe tha the person is from Sandar. I would like to know what reasons!!'Var i Hed. ved farens død' - was in Hedrum at the time of her fathers dead. Probably a piece of information extracted from the probate record of Anders Mortensen. I will check this record one day.I think you should forget the two Anders Mortensens at Bukkeli, Tjøme. According to the Tjøme bygdebok it can't be any of them. Apparently we are looking for an Anders Mortensen arriving in Larvik County (Hedrum, Sandar, Brunlanes, Tjølling, Tjøme) after 1701.

[Gjest Hans Mathisen]

To Kristian: Tjølling bygdebok, page 527, says: 'Anders Mortensen (visstnok fra Sandar) d. 1722, 64 år'. So this may be the author's reason for his belief conserning where Anders may have come from.

[Gjest Kristian Hunskaar]

Hans,I was peculiar about Tjølling bygdebok's author's reason (not Jeff Erickson's!) to believe that Anders was from Sandar. That still remains a question.I guess it is an assumption made by Lorens Berg, who wrote the first bygdebok for Tjølling, but he seldom explained the background for his assumptions. Perhaps he knew about the two men at Bukkeli, but at the time he wrote his book for Tjølling, he still had not written about Tjøme, so he may have changed his view later on. (A similar example is that when Berg wrote his book for Hedrum, he guessed that Børre Ellefsen Melau was from Åsen in Andebu. Later, though, when he wrote about Sandar, he found that Børre was from Bø in Sandar.)

[Gjest Jeff Erickson]

Is the way forward to find out where Anders Mortensen's wife - Ellen Frantzdtr came from and where/when they married - (1701 or before)?

[Gjest Kristian Hunskaar]

It's probably a needle in the same haystack. As some of their children seems to be born before 1701, the marriage took place before 1701, and hence Ellen Fransdatter also has moved in from outside Larvik county. I have already checked the available marriage records at http://www.vestfold-slekt.net without finding them. However, there's a lot of parishes yet not available. Also, many parishes have failed in preserving churchbooks from before 1700.

[Gjest Kristian Hunskaar]

Solution (!):As I wrote my last contribution, I reminded myself that Frans was not a very common name, and a couple of Frans's in Stokke parish crossed my mind. And that seems to be bull's eye:Bergan in Stokke (freely translated) -[url="http://www.vestfold-slekt.net/stokke/bygdebok/bergan.html:>LenkeIvar Fransen farmed Bergan abt. 1635-1675. Became owner of the farm.Frans Ivarsen, his son, farmed Bergan abt. 1663-1690, for a time together with his father. We know two children, a daughter married to Anders Mortensen at Søndre Holt, and the son Torstein, who became the next farmer. The widow apparently married Ingebret Arnesen who died here 1728, 78 years of age.Given that Frans is a rare name, this daughter must be Ellen - and Anders Mortensen at Søndre Holt must be Anders Mortensen at Håkestad Østre. Marriages for Stokke parish starts 1717, so we can't compare with the churchbook. Let's see what is written about Søndre Holt (sadly not too much):Søndre Holt in Stokke (freely translated) -

[Gjest Jeff Erickson]

Thanks KristianThe links in [8] do not work.I am not convinced the Anders Mortensen's from Bukelli can be discounted. The Anders at Håkestad Østre was born about 1756 (about 41 in 1701). We only know that the Anders Mortenson at Søndre Holt was there from 1690 - 1700 . We are not sure who was at Håkestad Østre from 170-1715 when a Anders Mortensen and his family arrived. After 1715 he could have moved back to Bukkeli. What is the connection with Hedrum (Karen 'f ca 1708 var i Hed ved farens dod')

[Gjest Kristian Hunskaar]

As Ketil Firing Hanssen once wrote: The Anders Mortensen's from Bukkeli died 1708 and 1738 respectively. - - - Anders Mortensen at Håkestad Østre died 1722. He can't possibly die twice!As I wrote earlier, I have to check the probate record of Anders Mortensen to find the connection to Hedrum. There are at least three possibilities: 1) Karen was a maid in Hedrum. 2) Karen was raised there by non-relatives. 3) Karen was raised there by relatives (obviously the more exciting possibility for us!). My guess is 1), but you'll have to wait and see.I don't know why the links don't work; try http://www.vestfold-slekt.net/ , choose 'Stokke' from the bottom of the page, and then 'Bergan' and/or 'Holt' from the left frame.

[Gjest Kristian Hunskaar]

Hi; I pick up an old thread.We concluded that we didn't know where Anders Mortensen lived 1701-15.I've now found out that Stokke bygdebok was wrong. Anders lived at Søndre Holt still in 1714, moreover, he owned 1/4 of the farm. But at this point, he was forced to sell his part, and probably move. This explains perfectly well why shows up at Håkestad the next year.

[Gjest Jeff Erickson]

Hi KristianThank you It solves a bit of the puzzle. Are you able to tell me the source of the new informationThanks again Best Wishes Jeff

[Gjest Kristian Hunskaar]

It's the probate of Håkon Eriksen (April 20th 1714). He was the other farmer at Søndre Holt. Anders and Håkon were not related, but the probate tells us that Håkon sold Anders a part of the farm in 1701 (or 1704 - problem with reading). When Håkon died, a descendant of a former owner claimed his right to buy the farm, and we are told that Anders still owned his part. The probate doesn't tell, but it's likely that Anders had to sell (it can probably be confirmed by other sources at the province archive at Kongsberg).

[Gjest Jeff Erickson]

KristianThanks againJeff