[#76922] Tønsberg birth record -- help?

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Can anyone help me to decipher a birth record for Tønsberg? Here is the link: LenkeI can see that the child, Knut, b. 10 May 1923, had these parents:Matros, Olaus Kristian Pedersen & Kone Sørine Henriette OlsenBut there is some other writing before the parents' names that I can't make out.Also, is it clear that these two people are married? I wonder because I can't find any record of their marriage in Tønsberg.Also, in 1925, Olaus Kristian Pedersen had a son, Severin Kristian, with another woman, Hanna Mathilde Nilsen. I can't find their marriage either.Can anyone help me??Hilsen Patti Mikkelsen

[Gjest Berit Knudsen]

Parents: divorced man matros Olaus/Claus? Kristian Pedersen, born 1882, adr. H... Guttormsgt. 7. Divorced wife tobaccoworker Sørine Henriette Olsen, b.1884, adr. Fo... 1. Witnesses: styrmann Konrad Pedersen, bryggeriarbeider Hilding Andersen, Olga/Algo? Hovland and Margit Andersen. Knut was born in marriage.Just a guess. Maybe Olaus and Sørine had been married and was divorced before Knut was born?

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Thank you, BeritI know that Sørine Henriette Karlsen married Theodor Kornelius Olsen on 20 Dec 1908. They had a daughter, Margot in 1914. So, I wonder, in Knut's birth record, when they say that Sørine was divorced, could they mean from Theodor?Another question -- if a married couple conceives a child, but is divorced before the child is born, is that child considered born 'in marriage'?Are divorces recorded in the kirkebøker?Again, many thanks...Hilsen Patti

[Gjest Jon Erik Berg-Hansen]

Obviously both Sørine and Olaus had been living in separate marriages, and both were divorced. In marriage: A tricky question - my guess is yes (conceived in marriage). Divorces are only listed in parish records in cases when the persons in question remarries. I'm not sure what office listed the divorces - but the church was not involved.

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Thank you JonIt makes sense that Sørine & Olaus were living in separate marriages. What I don't know is whether they were ever married to each other. I've looked from 1914-1923 in Tønsberg, Nøtterøy & Tjøme. Nothing. I thought Tønsberg was the most logical location, since Olaus was born there and was living there in 1900. Although Sørine was born in Nøtterøy, when she married Theodor and had Margot, she lived in Tønsberg.It's a mystery...mvh Patti

[Gjest Jon Erik Berg-Hansen]

You can also try taking a look at Sem/Slagen parish - now a part of Tønsberg.

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Thanks, Jon. I'll do that!

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Well... I didn't find where Olaus married Sørine, but I did find another marriage that I was searching for! So, it wasn't a total loss.mvh Patti

[Gjest Jon Erik Berg-Hansen]

Why keep looking for this marriage - you've got no indications they ever got married. Kristian Severin baptized: [url="http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=76&idx_id=76&uid=ny&idx_side=-91>Lenke The parents listed as married.Olaus in 1900:LenkeCould this be Sørine in 1900:

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

If you see my first post in this string -- Olaus and Sørine had a son, Knut, in 1923. According to the kirkebok, he was born 'in marriage'. At least, I believe that is the case. Do you disagree?Hilsen Patti

[Gjest Wenche Örbeck Kristiansen]

Perhaps the parents divorced before the baptised day. Knut was born in march and bapticed in june.And they had diffirent adress.So I think that Berit is right in (2)her guesses! Good luck! Wenche

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Hei WencheI guess it's not so important. It's a little thing that I wish I could figure out.Are you saying that Sørine & Olaus had different addresses in Knut's baptism record? Then, it makes sense that they might have been married when Knut was born, but divorced by the time of his baptism.Still, that leaves me with the nagging question of when and where they were married. But I have looked all the logical places. I think this will remain a mystery...mvh Patti

[Gjest Jon Erik Berg-Hansen]

(10) YES - I disagree! That entry clearly states the fact that they were not married at that time 'Divorced mann sailor --- and Divorced kone tobaccoworker ---. If they had been married at that time, she would have listed as hstr. (hustru) = wife - see other entries on that page.

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Hei JonYes, I understand that the entry shows both were divorced. What confused me was the fact that under the column 'om egte eller uegte født' for Knut it shows 'i.e.', which I took to mean he was born 'in marriage'. Is this correct?Here's a question for you... could what is written for Sørine possibly mean separated instead of divorced? If she was still technically married to Theodor Olsen, even though he was not the father of Knut, could that explain the 'i.e.' label?To add to the mystery a bit more, Olaus had a child with another woman, Hanna Mathilde Nilsen, in 1925. I assume they were married because they are buried together. But I can't find this marriage either. Of course, I'm not going to spend any more time searching for his marriage to Hanna, since neither of them is related to me.As I wrote to Wenche, this will probably remain a mystery.

[Gjest Jon Erik Berg-Hansen]

You're absolutely right: i.e. means in marriage. Your question for me: I'v got no idea! I too have been looking for their marriage prior to Sept. 1925

[Gjest Patricia Carlsen Mikkelsen]

Thanks for responding, JonI am baffled by this. I wonder if, after her divorce from Theodor and short-lived marriage to Olaus, if Sørine gave up on men?! She is buried under her birth name (Karlsen). Children, Knut & Margot, are buried in the same plot (Tønsberg gamle, AU-09-15) with her.If you are searching on my behalf, I really appreciate it, but you don't need to continue. I have given up!mvh Patti