Request for help locating great-grandfather in Larvik in mid-1800s

[Louise Ober]

25 minutes ago, Anton Hagelee said:

 

I know you directed your questions to Inger, but I will jump in here and answer a few of them. I am sure Inger can provide better answers tomorrow as well. Here is a discussion on naming practices in Norway.

 

'In Norway prior to the 1860s families did not use fixed surnames. They used a patronymic pattern in which children were named after their father. Hence, John Andersen = John, the son of Anders."

 

From 

https://norwegianridge.com/2011/07/10/understanding-norwegian-naming-patterns/

 

As well as the last name in America coming from the fathers first name, Norwegian emigrants used the name of the farm they were associated with in Norway. For example my last name of Hagelee comes from the farm my grandfather was born on Høgeli. 

 

And in a search for the origins  of the early settlers of  Hickory Grove Township, Wisconsin a Ole Brown was found to have been  a  Ole Syverson Brunsbakke born in Hedalen, Sør-Aurdal 12.9.1824.

 

The last name of a parish or sub-parish can also be used. For example the parish of Brunlanes has produced the last name of Brown in America. 

 

 

 

 

HI Anton, Excellent and very helpful to know about these naming customs, thank you.  How did people figure out that Ole Brown was really Ole Brunsbakke?!   Similarly, though, my thinking was that perhaps my g-grandfather (who apparently didn't use a patronym) used/adopted the name Brown from either his municipality (e.g., Brunlanes) or his family's farm.  Which was also Inger's suggestion, I think.  What I don't know is whether/how one can research farm names or birth records from Brunlanes? I would like to think there is some way to investigate this.  

With appreciation, Louise

[Louise Ober]

1 hour ago, Anton Hagelee said:

One other comment, I would make is to not get too discouraged that you have not yet found the ancestry of your William Henry Brown. 

 

In my case i encountered a so called brick wall. It was finally solved after years of searching by using a Y-DNA test. I tested on Familytree DNA and posted the results there and on NorwayProject. After two years of waiting I finally got a close match (called Genetic Distance GD ) of 1. Meaning a relationship in 6 generations or less. The match and I compared our family trees and found a common ancestor. 

 

So keep on working on the paper trail, consider using DNA technology and do not give up the search. 

Anton, thanks for the encouragement.  I didn't know that DNA could help in cases like this, but your own story is inspiring.  I am determined to continue with the paper trail research, but it's nice to know there is another option.  

[Inger Hohler]

Anton Hagelee did a great job of explaining Norwegian last names and some of the changes that were typical of immigrants for the US.

Note that while there is currently a county called Vestfold and Telemark, the Digital Archive still has one search preference for Vestfold and another for Telemark.

One thing I would like to add, though, is that most immigrants had siblings in Norway. When selecting names for their own children, those Norwegians might be strongly influenced by the new names of their emigrated sister or brother, or for the names of their nephews and nieces. 

In the 1801 census, there were no Henrys. There were a lot of Henriks or Henrichs etc., though.

In 1865 there were 17 Henrys in Vestfold and 503 Henriks of various spellings.
In 1875 there were 25 Henrys in Vestfold and 592 Henriks of various spellings.
In the 1900 census there were 281 Henrys in "Vestfold", 471 Henriks with variant spellings. (My great uncle would have been one of them if his parents had not temporarily been living in Bergen. He was named after his uncle's son, his uncle having emigrated to the US.)
You can also look at the names of your William Henry Brown's children, and see if you can find a match for other names that are uncommon in Norway.

William as a search phrase will include Viljam, so it cannot be used as easily. Formerly people did not regard the spelling of a name to be that important. 'Henry" sounds too different from 'Henrik' to be easily equated, but that's not the case for 'William' and 'Viljam'.

This is no foolproof method, but it might make the seaching task less daunting.

 

[Anton Hagelee]

13 hours ago, Louise Ober said:

 What I don't know is whether/how one can research farm names or birth records from Brunlanes? I would like to think there is some way to investigate

 

I am going to assume from your question that you do not use often the Digitalarivet search program. That might mean I am over explaining the process. 

 

Go to 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no

 

Click on the  English version, look for the Bokmål up in the right hand corner, click the down arrow to see English

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/

 

Click Advanced Person Search 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/search/persons/advanced

 

Click on Geography, then Østland then Vestfold then Brunlanes

 

Use the middle boxes to search names, birth years etc. The Domicile box searches farm names.  The * is useable to shorten the search. ie Bru* in Domicile searches all those domiciles that start with Bru

 

Further questions just ask, too much "mansplaining", let me know. 😀

 

 

 

 

Endret Juni 17, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Richard Olsen]

On 6/17/2022 at 11:44 AM, Anton Hagelee said:

I am going to assume from your question that you do not use often the Digitalarivet search program. That might mean I am over explaining the process. 

 

I already did that search.

 

Louise, let me give you a bit of my background

 

1. Researcher for more than 40 years

2. Genealogy Research - 25 years

3. County Co-ordinator

4. Author and Publisher of a Family History Book

5. (Re) united people with their biological families

6. Research Fee - $60 -$100 per hour (Genealogy Research)

7. Retired

In addition:

8. Instrumental in assisiting Governments with changes in education, social, health, etc, institutes

 

I give honesty with all of my statements. There is a possibility, slight as it may be, to locate more information on William Henry Brown in Norway. However, it will be time consuming, a lot of effort, and costly. There are many generous people on this forum who helped many with their genealogy quests. They are owed a huge thank-you. However, generosity only goes so far. To continue will have a monetary cost.

 

If your interest is strong and you want to continue the search in Norway, you will need to find a genealogist-for-hire.

 

This is my last posting on this thread. Good Luck!

 

 

Endret Juni 18, 2022 av Richard Olsen

[Louise Ober]

6 hours ago, Richard Olsen said:

Louise, let me give you a bit of my background

...

I give honesty with all of my statements. There is a possibility, slight as it may be, to locate more information on William Henry Brown in Norway. However, it will be time consuming, a lot of effort, and costly. There are many generous people on this forum who helped many with their genealogy quests. They are owed a huge thank-you. However, generosity only goes so far. To continue will have a monetary cost.

 

If your interest is strong and you want to continue the search in Norway, you will need to find a genealogist-for-hire.

 

This is my last posting on this thread. Good Luck!

Hello Richard, You have been so generous with your time, and I'm grateful for your willingness to share findings about my search!  You are clearly very skilled at what you do.

 

I have been racing to keep up with incoming new information, but let me at least try to respond to some of your comments:

 

1.     I was interested to learn that you had done DNA tests to locate your Boston g-grandfather, especially when other research yielded incorrect information.  Perhaps I will need to turn to that at some point.

2.    Thank you for checking the “in and out migration” records in Vestfold/Larvik, and also the seamen records.  I now better understand how to search the digitalarkivet site myself, so I have been able to do some further exploration. But already I can see that there are very few “hits” using permutations of the name(s) of my relative.  

3.   The story (in Norwegian) about William Henry Brown was a great find, even if it turned out to be part of a work of fiction! Thanks for mentioning that and getting others to help.  

4.   Your findings about (multiple/different)  William Browns in Gloucester, Mass after 1850 were very helpful in allowing me to see the inconsistencies as to whether he had any brothers in the US. At first I thought he was the same WB as the 22 year old Norwegian who fished and lived with an older brother Jacob Brown (age 27) in Gloucester in 1855 (census). The fact that he might be living alone five years later in 1860 (age 27/28, with no brother) could still make sense, if he were about to move to Boston the next year to be with his new wife.  But it's hard to reconcile that  27/28 year old William Brown with the much older 34-year old William Brown living in Gloucester in the same year (1860) with (the same?) Jacob Brown (now age 30) and (a new) James Brown (age 25) (also Norwegian fisherman). Although that 34-year old WB could be the WB who stuck around and was recorded as still living in Gloucester (with no brothers) in 1870. So if just the younger WB is the only possible relative of mine, are Jacob and/or James his brothers?  It's a conundrum, but one you are probably used to seeing in this business.

 

Clearly the reason to get a handle on these brothers is to cast a wider net of family members who may trace their roots back to (Larvig) Norway. (I will also follow the earlier suggestion to check out fellow Norwegian housemate, Gunder Krabel.) 

 

5.  I feel I have a pretty good handle on the Wiliam H. Brown who ended up in Boston in 1861. As you point out, the Naval enlistment records and citizenship records are undoubtedly his, as he tried to solidify his economic prospects (no doubt as a parent with many mouths to feed)! 

 

6. The other unexplored area from my standpoint is WB's return to Norway around 1887 with his daughter K/Clara. Where he went, whom he visited, etc. Clearly this is another opportunity to explore his past (but more recent) connections to Larvig, or the actual place he came from. 

 

I will keep digging. It may be at the end of the day I have to do a DNA test and/or hire a genealogist to make any progress on the Norwegian heritage. If so, I appreciate having your offer of services. 

 

All the best,

Louise

[Louise Ober]

8 hours ago, Anton Hagelee said:

 

I am going to assume from your question that you do not use often the Digitalarivet search program. That might mean I am over explaining the process. 

...

Further questions just ask, too much "mansplaining", let me know. 😀

 

Anton, you assumed correctly!  THANK YOU this is just the level of detailed instruction I needed to search the Digitalarivet site on my own!  No accusations of "mansplaining"!  It's slow-going, but at least I can see all the categories and parishes and dates, plus I am learning some Norwegian (barn, far, avdød, brudgom, etc.). Thanks, again! 

-Louise

[Anton Hagelee]

I have another suggestion for you. It is a long shot but it will not take much effort on your part. There are two other sites that do searches. A Norwegian site called Slekt og Data. It is a part of the Genealogy Society of Norway. I think that it recently became a pay site so probably not useful at this time. The third site is on the NorwayHeritage site. It is an english language site so easy for you to use. It has a much smaller cadre of researchers, including myself,  but they sometimes can find useful information. 

 

If you post there be sure and put in a link to your original post on Digitalarkivet so the researchers at NorwayHeritage do not have to cover old ground. I check the site regularly so I will keep an eye on the research. 

 

At NorwayHeritage you have to set up a user name and password but the use of the site is free. 

 

Here is a link to the site, click on  Register to set up your user name and password. 

 

http://www.norwayheritage.com/snitz/

 

Low expectations, but you could get lucky. 

 

Lykke til

 

 

Endret Juni 18, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Richard Olsen]

16 hours ago, Louise Ober said:

Although that 34-year old WB could be the WB who stuck around and was recorded as still living in Gloucester (with no brothers) in 1870. So if just the younger WB is the only possible relative of mine, are Jacob and/or James his brothers?

 

Louise

 

I feel that I should clarify something so you don't go on a wild goose chase.

 

William Brown in Gloucester in 1855, 1860, and 1870

Your William Henry Brown is in the Boston Census 1870 with his family

Obviously, the WB in Gloucester can not be your William Henry Brown

 

You might want to consider contacting as many descendants of William Henry Brown as you can, and ask what they know about WHB.

Endret Juni 18, 2022 av Richard Olsen

[Anton Hagelee]

I have found no good candidates in Larvik born in 1832 through 1834. Not in the baptism records nor in the confirmation records. 

 

Working the sea coast parishes from Kragerø, Telemark, up the coast looking at 1832 to 1834 baptism records,  I find one candidate. These are of course going to be long shots but that is where we are at. 

 

Henrik born 26 Feb 1834. Father is Henrik Hansen. Farm is Bjørn.

 

First entry on the page 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20061204030264

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/255/pd00000038045001

 

I did not find him in the  1865 and 1875 Census, but there is a Henrik Henriksen born in 1836  who pops up as a father in 1873. So we need to eliminate him.. 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/255/pd00000024526646

 

No candidates in Bamble, Porsgrunn, Eidanger og Siljan , Telemark

 

 

Endret Juni 18, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Sven Hjortland]

12 minutter siden, Anton Hagelee skrev:

I did not find him in the  1865 and 1875 Census, but there is a Henrik Henriksen born in 1836  who pops up as a father in 1873. So we need to eliminate him.. 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/255/pd00000024526646

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/327/pv00000007696568

[Sven Hjortland]

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/267/pg00000000789703

[Anton Hagelee]

9 minutes ago, Sven Hjortland said:

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/267/pg00000000789703

 

Good find, so he is not the Hendrik from 1872 but one who died very young. Still eliminated as a candidate. 

[Louise Ober]

On 6/14/2022 at 12:18 PM, Anton Hagelee said:

I notice that the passenger next to William Brown is a Klara Brown born art 1861. Perhaps he took his daughter on the trip. Louise Ober, perhaps someone in your family tree has a record of who or where in Norway they went to visit on that trip?

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/8/pe00000001015722

I have been following up on the K/Clara Brown you found traveling with William Brown when he left Oslo, Norway in August 1887, heading to Liverpool, England on the ship Rollo, to confirm that it is most likely my g-grandfather traveling with his daughter for that entire trip. The transcribed version shows Klara Brown, age 26, the exact age she would have been in 1887. Would there be a handwritten passenger list for that trip?  That might show more information about where their trip from Norway started, perhaps?

 

I hadn't checked previously to see if I could also find K/Clara on the second leg of the voyage from Hull, England to Boston later in August, 1887, and I have now found the person I believe to be her! She appears as Clara Brown on a different part of the passenger list than where her dad, William Brown, is listed (wouldn't passengers traveling together be listed together, or did they separate men from women, I wonder?). Tediously, Clara's age appears to be written as 46 rather than 26 on the Boston trip, but the 4 could be a 2, perhaps. 

These are small victories, but I am savoring them. 

 

I guess I'm still wondering whether this trip, or an earlier one William made apparently by himself in 1855, might have conincided with a family event in his home town - and will try searching parish records for some death or marriage he might have attended. 

Endret Juni 19, 2022 av Louise Ober

[Kristian Hunskaar (privat)]

4 timer siden, Louise Ober skrev:

I have been following up on the K/Clara Brown you found traveling with William Brown when he left Oslo, Norway in August 1887, heading to Liverpool, England on the ship Rollo, to confirm that it is most likely my g-grandfather traveling with his daughter for that entire trip. The transcribed version shows Klara Brown, age 26, the exact age she would have been in 1887. Would there be a handwritten passenger list for that trip?  That might show more information about where their trip from Norway started, perhaps?

 

The original emigration protocol is shown here: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/em20110222670786

Endret Juni 19, 2022 av Kristian Hunskaar (privat)

[Anton Hagelee]

I wonder if this guy is worth a harder look. 

 

Hans born 12 Feb 1832 Tjølling, Vestfold Nr.5. Father Hans Sørensen mother Maren Sophie Hansdatter. 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20051017051086

 

Parents were married in Hedrum in 1829 Nr. 16 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070502610125

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/person/pf01051184000787

 

Hans Hansen was confirmed in 1846 in Tjølling Nr. 9

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20051017050198

 

 

 

 

 

Endret Juni 19, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Sven Hjortland]

7 minutter siden, Anton Hagelee skrev:

I wonder if this guy is worth a harder look. 

 

Hans born 12 Feb 1832 Tjølling, Vestfold Nr.5. Father Hans Sørensen mother Maren Sophie Hansdatter. 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20051017051086

 

 

 

Hans Sørensen died in 1885 https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/267/pg00000001589158

[Anton Hagelee]

Also wonder who is this guy? 

 

Hans Sørensen Bruun

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/255/pd00000011076889

 

Maybe a false lead, can come back to it later if it warrants.

 

This is likely Hans Henrik Sørensen, as a widower he married Anne Marie Tobiasdatter in Larvik in 1829. 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/327/pv00000002263648

 

And they had a child Nils Henrik 17 Aug 1832 in Larvig. Making him an unlikely candidate to have fathered William Henry Brown. 

 

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/14101287:60092?_phsrc=dSQ4&_phstart=successSource&ml_rpos=4&queryId=dc90ff97f6ddd4fb931665c3eef6d885

 

 

 

 

 

 

Endret Juni 19, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Sven Hjortland]

26 minutter siden, Sven Hjortland skrev:

Hans Sørensen died in 1885 https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/267/pg00000001589158

 

[Sven Hjortland]

The obit for Hans Sørensen Lindhjem indicates that 1 daughter in Norway and 1 son in America survives him. No names given for the son.

 

https://www.nb.no/items/bc5e79d13ef53f69648e38b2135aa21e?page=1&searchText="HANS SØRENSEN LINDHJEM"

 

 

[Sven Hjortland]

1 time siden, Anton Hagelee skrev:

mother Maren Sophie Hansdatter

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/267/pg00000001588538

[Anton Hagelee]

This is likely the daughter 

 

Anne Malene Hansen

in the Norway, Select Baptisms, 1634-1927

Name:Anne Malene Hansen

Gender:Female

Birth Date:5 okt 1834 (5 Oct 1834)

Baptism Date:14 Nov 1834

Baptism Place:Tjolling,Vestfold,Norway

Father:Hans Sorensen

Mother:Maren Sophie Hansdr

FHL Film Number:127679

 

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/8488786:60092?_phsrc=LGS5&_phstart=successSource&gsfn=ann*&ml_rpos=5&queryId=2795fec6e284ab31fb0ee4e95bfef419

 

Nr. 20 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070427630307

 

1865 Census 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/person/pf01038121001382

 

 

Endret Juni 19, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Sven Hjortland]

No. 10 Hans Hansen Lindhjem leaves for Arendal? in 1848

 

Vestfold fylke, Tjølling i Tjølling, Ministerialbok nr. 6 (1835-1859), Inn- og utflyttede 1849, Side 428
Permanent bilde-ID: kb20051017050375
Brukslenke for sidevisning: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20051017050375
Permanent bildelenke: https://urn.digitalarkivet.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20051017050375.jpg
 

[Sven Hjortland]

16 minutter siden, Anton Hagelee skrev:

This is likely the daughter 

 

Anne Malene Hansen

in the Norway, Select Baptisms, 1634-1927

Name:Anne Malene Hansen

Gender:Female

Birth Date:5 okt 1834 (5 Oct 1834)

Baptism Date:14 Nov 1834

Baptism Place:Tjolling,Vestfold,Norway

Father:Hans Sorensen

Mother:Maren Sophie Hansdr

FHL Film Number:127679

 

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/8488786:60092?_phsrc=LGS5&_phstart=successSource&gsfn=ann*&ml_rpos=5&queryId=2795fec6e284ab31fb0ee4e95bfef419

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/267/pg00000001584439

[Inger Hohler]

Hans Hansen Lindhjem did a runner to escape from military service.
Born 12th of February 1832 https://www.nb.no/items/a3cbf8c99469f044ee7cbe4a5049d41f?page=1&searchText="hANS hANSEN lINDHJEM"

Morgenbladet 22nd December 1854, The text says roughly:
"Wanted
The following members of the 'Hedrumske Compagni' (The Hedrum Unit) failed to show up and their whereabouts are unknown.
Tjølling parish:
...
Hans Hansen Lindhjem etc." 
 

Endret Juni 19, 2022 av Inger Hohler
Added rough translation