[#69471] Lars Askildsen/Aschildsen/Aschieldsen gift 29/05/1767 Elis. Johnsdatter, Arendal

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

I am looking for any information or suggestions for more information on this couple who are currently a dead end on my family tree. I know they had a daughter named Elisabeth Charlotte in born in 1776 and I believe that Lars was a merchant in Arendal. I am particularly interested to know when and where each was born, and have yet to determine death information.Thank youTybring Hemphil

[Gjest Grethe Flood]

Could Johanne Lavine (No 17) be Elisabeth Charlotte's elder sister? - Aust-Agder fylke, Arendal, Ministerialbok nr. A 2 (1771-1815), Fødte og døpte 1772, side 3. Permanent sidelenke: [url="http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=9400&idx_id=9400&uid=ny&idx_side=-5>Lenke Permanent bildelenke:

[Gjest Grethe Flood]

Here is the baptism record for Elisabeth Charlotte - Aust-Agder county, Arendal, Parish register (official) nr. A 2 (1771-1815), Birth and baptism records 1776, page 9. Permanent pagelink: [url="http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=9400&idx_id=9400&uid=ny&idx_side=-11>Lenke Permanent imagelink:

[Gjest Grethe Flood]

Lars and Elisabeth also had a son Johannes, born 1774 - Aust-Agder county, Arendal, Parish register (official) nr. A 2 (1771-1815), Birth and baptism records 1774, page 6. Permanent pagelink: [url="http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=9400&idx_id=9400&uid=ny&idx_side=-8>Lenke Permanent imagelink: LenkeThis might be Johannes Aschildsen in the 1801 census return for Arendal

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

Thank you Grethe, I had not thought of looking for siblings. I think that may be the most helpful approach.I have now found the following children:Gundil Marie bapt. Apr. 29, 1769 Johannes Andreas bapt. Dec. 13, 1770 Johanne Lovine bapt. Aug 8, 1772 Johannes bapt. Aug 29, 1774 Elisabet Charlotte bapt. Mar. 16,1776If the parents followed typical naming patterns the parents of Lars could be either Askild or Johannes and his mother likely Johanne. The father of Lisbet is harder to guess but the mother should be Gundil. Interestingly, witnesses to the baptism of Gundil Marie include a Gundil Knudsdatter. I also noted there was a Knud Askildsen who with his wife Sophie Johanisdatter had a son Johannes baptised May 17, 1783 (maybe the Gundil name is really on the Askildsen side of the family along with Knud).I also found their engagement in 1767, but found no clues there. I'm afraid I have not had success attaching links as you do. Thanks for your help so far!Tybring

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

Thank you Grethe, I had not thought of looking for siblings. I think that may be the most helpful approach.I have now found the following children:Gundil Marie bapt. Apr. 29, 1769 Johannes Andreas bapt. Dec. 13, 1770 Johanne Lovine bapt. Aug 8, 1772 Johannes bapt. Aug 29, 1774 Elisabet Charlotte bapt. Mar. 16,1776If the parents followed typical naming patterns the parents of Lars could be either Askild or Johannes and his mother likely Johanne. The father of Lisbet is harder to guess but the mother should be Gundil. Interestingly, witnesses to the baptism of Gundil Marie include a Gundil Knudsdatter. I also noted there was a Knud Askildsen who with his wife Sophie Johanisdatter had a son Johannes baptised May 17, 1783 (maybe the Gundil name is really on the Askildsen side of the family along with Knud).I also found their engagement in 1767, but found no clues there. I'm afraid I have not had success attaching links as you do. Thanks for your help so far!Tybring

[Gjest Grethe Flood]

Here is the marriage record for Johannes Askildsen and Jørgine (Georgine) Erboe from 1797, Bamble, Telemark county (formerly Bratsberg amt) - Telemark county, Bamble, Parish register (official) nr. 2 (1775-1814), Marriage records 1795-1798, page 472-473. Permanent pagelink: [url="http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=7823&idx_id=7823&uid=ny&idx_side=-187>Lenke Permanent imagelink:

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

I don't know if you knew Elisabeth Charlotte Askildsen husband and their 10 children - and of course his family ?I have knowledge of most of them.

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

Hi Leif, I am descended from Elisabeth and her husband Lars Westergaard (1764-1822) through their son Johannes Askildsen Westergaard. I actually have copies of silhouettes of Lars and Elisabeth that come from the archives in Arendal if you are interested. I would be pleased to know more about their family if you are willing to share your information.What do you and Grethe think about whether any of the witnesses to the baptism of the first child of Lars Askildsen and his wife were in fact their parents. Can anyone explain the information in the notice of 'Trolovede' which think is 'engagement'?Tybring

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

Hi Tybring,I have an old chart over the Westergaard family, starting with Lars Larsen Westergaard 1728-1792 and his two wifes. I have gone further back by luck found 'Klim slægter' (from Denmark) going back to about 1600 with quite good knowledge.Johannes Askildsen Westergaard 1814-1900 (the youngest child of Lars W 1764-1822) was married 1799 to Ottilia Dedekam 1815-1882. I have 6 children, but only for the oldest, Anders Dedekam Westergaard (1843-) have I wife and children.Afraid of spam (these pages can be scanned by spammers) I don't usually give my emailadress here, but hope you can read it. Try ! It starts with my first name, and followed by the the last name, without spaces (and without the last letter) - all small letters. Then the greek letter followed by the first letter i Elisabeths second first name (small), two as number, the letter i, dot net. (no other dot).I don't have those silhuets and would fancy them. I can send you a pdf if you can tell me more spesific what you are looking for.Leif

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

Hi Leif,I'm not having any luck with your email - I've tried every variation I can think of (with and without dots between first and second name, leaving the last letter off first or second name, etc.) Can you give me a clue?Tybring

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

Hi, Tybring.Sorry, my fault. I mixed two of my adr.From first name, only the first letter, from last name 7. Try again.Leif

[Gjest Jarl V. Erichsen]

In the reprinted book 'Arendal byes historie' (= The history of Arendal) from 1893/1998 these people/families are described. I think it is to much to write down here.On page 52 there are presented profiles/illustration of Lars Westergaard and Elisabeth Charlotte Aschieldsen.- Jarl -

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

Thank you Jarl for the tip. I have located the book and it does indeed have helpful information on the Askildsen family. Specifically, I have learned on p.186, that Lars Askildsen was born in 1742 at Trontvedt, Treungen and died in 1793 (presumably in Arendal) I shall try to confirm some of this in the Church books.Tybring

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

Here you find Lars in 1793 Lenke buried 21.9.1793 51 year old.

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

Here you find the daugther of Lars, Johanne Lovine Askildsen married to Arnt Bruun Lenke

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

I have tried to look for Lars Askildsen in church-records from 1742 and discover that Treungen in that time was under Kviteseid, Telemark, but unfortunately, there is no churchbook som early.His wife, Lisbeth (Elisabeth) is hard to be found, but when the marriage is in Arendal, she should be born there, probably from a family of the same class. Here is the only one I found Lenke Elizabeth Andrea 25.9.1742 daughter of Mons. (Monsigneur) Johanes Joenson and Bete Ellefsdtr. from Kolbiørnsvig.Lars Askildsen is known as Mons. (Monsigneur) to.I think there is more than 50 % chance for that this is the right person, and if one can find her death and age then, it can be more verified.Leif

[Gjest Oddbjørn Johannessen]

The Kviteseid church books starts in 1754. Trontveit is not a Treungen farm, but is situated in Nissedal parish, on the left side of the Nisser lake. I will therefore suppose that Lars Askildsen was batized in Nissedal church - not in Treungen church. Maybe it would be possible to find his confirmation (about 1766-67)?

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

Johannes Askildsen was married to Georgine (Jørgine) Erboe. Here you find a lot more about her and the Erboe family Lenke,9483,9495 (Everything until 9495 must be in the adress).There you also find their two children, both unmarried. The daughter has the middlename Sommer which you also find the origin to in the same tread.You will find a lot more information if you click on 'Fortsettelse ....' at the bottom.

[Gjest Leif Salicath]

I think the start of the thread is here: [url="http://www.grenlandslekt.no/phorum-5.1.23//read.php?1>Lenke,9444,9444#msg-9444 (all of it must be in the link)and

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

I have tried to find Lars Askildsen in the Nissedal church confirmation records but could not find him (the records are hard to read, though). I also could not find his widow Lisabet in the Arendal burial records between 1793 and 1801. According to Arendals byes Historie she remarried a man named Niels Rolfsen after Lars' death in 1793, but by the 1801 census he was married again, meaning that she must have died.Tybring

[Gjest Oddbjørn Johannessen]

I agree. Lars Askildsen is definitely not to be found in the confirmation records - neither in Nissedal, nor in Treungen. He might have moved to another parish (for instance as a servant/hind on a farm?) and been confirmated there...

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

I have located in the marriage records of Arendal a Madame Maren Askildsen 'enke' married Niels Rolfsen 'enkemand' on Jan.26, 1796. Is this Maren the same person as Lisabeth? There could not have been too many Askildsen widows in Arendal at the time. [url="http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20070329640301.jpg>LenkeI suppose we could also wonder if the Knud Askildsen is a brother of Lars and whether his wife Sophie Johanisdater referred to in #5 above is a sister of Lisabeth (Maren) Jonasdatter.LenkeFinally, what do you all think about the witnesses/godparents at the birth of Lars and Lisabeth's first child?

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

I have looked again at Arendals Byes Historie and it appears I misread the Norwegian the first time. Lars was married twice. Lisabeth was his first wife and Maren his second, so that clears up that mystery! Now I will have to find the death of Lisabeth between 1776 and 1793.Tybring

[Gjest Tybring Hemphill]

Unfortunately, I cannot find the death of Lisabeth, nor the subsequent marriage of Lars and Maren. This is very puzzling. I did note two other Askildsen marriages as seen in the linkLenkeTybring