Christian Falk/Peter Falk *Kristiansund-Dorset i England

[Caroline Falk]

12 minutes ago, Per.H.Skaug said:

Initially we were all responding in Norwegian to Karina, who made the Original Post, but now that you are on the thread, I think most of us wil try our best to respond in English. I am sure we can try to give at least a rough transcription if there is meaningful information in any of the records.

Karina is a star! she has been so kind and encouraging. I would not be searching so well without her.

[Frank Marton Pedersen]

The opening post says that Christian Falk had a somewhat dodgy reputation as a police officer. Could be true, after all he was caught stealing in 1878 after his career as a police constable was over. But he sure got some hassle from various individuals when he was a police constable. To his defence, I expect being a police officer in the 1870s was a rough trade.

 

The Derby Mercury (Derby, Derbyshire, England)

14 Jun 1876, Wed

Page 3

 

14 Jun 1876, 3 - The Derby Mercury at Newspapers.com

 

 

 

 

 

The Derby Mercury (Derby, Derbyshire, England)

31 May 1876, Wed

Page 8

 

31 May 1876, 8 - The Derby Mercury at Newspapers.com

 

 

 

 

The Derby Mercury (Derby, Derbyshire, England)

18 Jun 1873, Wed

Page 3

 

18 Jun 1873, 3 - The Derby Mercury at Newspapers.com

 

 

[Frank Marton Pedersen]

On 4/13/2021 at 6:32 PM, Frank Marton Pedersen said:

 

Allsopp and Sons var et stort bryggeri i Burton:

 

Allsopp & Sons Ltd - Brewery History Society Wiki

 

Det kan se ut som at Christian var ansatt som vaktmann her i 1878.

 

(Messrs. tror jeg er det samme som Mr.) 

 

Allsopp & Sons Ltd was a large company at the time Christian Falk was employed as a watchman. Looks like the company archive is linked up here:

 

Samuel Allsopp & Sons Ltd, brewers | The National Archives

 

Looks like the staff records are available from 1882, and possibly earlier if you are lucky?

I suppose it´s likely that Christian was fired after stealing in 1878, but it could be well worth investigating this further. 

 

 

Endret April 14, 2021 av Frank Marton Pedersen

[Karina Huseby]

På 14.4.2021 den 15.46, Inger Karin Haarbye skrev:

Har denne vært vurdert? Hans Christian Falch f. 19. febr. 1842 på Edøy. #14:

 

Møre og Romsdal county, Edøy, Brattvær, Hopen in Edøy, Parish register (official) no. 581A04 (1836-1852), Born and baptised 1842, Page 24
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070913660026
Permanent image-link: https://urn.digitalarkivet.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20070913660026.jpg

 

 

 

Det er mye mulig...må følge han videre og se hvor han evt dør da? Moren her heter jo Falck, og fadder med navn Falck. Far er da trolig Peder Jørgensen Veien f. 1820 fra Veiholmen, Edøy. Han gifter seg med Johanna 27/9-18757. Dette kan være et bra spor. Fant du noe mer på denne Hans Chr?

yes it may be. He is a illegitimate child. Must follow him to see where he dies. Mothers name is Falck, and among the witnesses from his baptizm ther are more Falck's. Peder came from Veiholmen, Edøy. He being bachelor and she was a spinster, he marry Johanna 27/9-1857. Mother of Hans Chr. was Alet Falck. 

Endret April 15, 2021 av Karina Huseby

[Karina Huseby]

21 timer siden, Frank Marton Pedersen skrev:

The opening post says that Christian Falk had a somewhat dodgy reputation as a police officer. Could be true, after all he was caught stealing in 1878 after his career as a police constable was over. But he sure got some hassle from various individuals when he was a police constable. To his defence, I expect being a police officer in the 1870s was a rough trade.

 

The Derby Mercury (Derby, Derbyshire, England)

14 Jun 1876, Wed

Page 3

 

14 Jun 1876, 3 - The Derby Mercury at Newspapers.com

 

 

 

 

 

The Derby Mercury (Derby, Derbyshire, England)

31 May 1876, Wed

Page 8

 

31 May 1876, 8 - The Derby Mercury at Newspapers.com

 

 

 

 

The Derby Mercury (Derby, Derbyshire, England)

18 Jun 1873, Wed

Page 3

 

18 Jun 1873, 3 - The Derby Mercury at Newspapers.com

 

 

Your findings are remarkable;-) 

[Karina Huseby]

34 minutter siden, Karina Huseby skrev:

Det er mye mulig...må følge han videre og se hvor han evt dør da? Moren her heter jo Alet Falck, og fadder med navn Falck. Far er da trolig Peder Jørgensen Veien f. 1820 fra Veiholmen, Edøy. Han gifter seg med Johanna 27/9-1857. Dette kan være et bra spor faktisk. Fant du noe mer på denne Hans Chr?

yes it may be. He is a illegitimate child. Must follow him to see where he dies. Mothers name is Alet Falck, and among the witnesses from his baptizm there are more Falck's. Peder came from Veiholmen, Edøy. He being bachelor and she was a spinster, he marry Johanna 27/9-1857?? 

Peder and Alet married 29/-1842:  https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/327/pv00000009274614

 

Endret April 15, 2021 av Karina Huseby

[Egil Johannessen]

26 minutter siden, Karina Huseby skrev:

Det er mye mulig...må følge han videre og se hvor han evt dør da? Moren her heter jo Falck, og fadder med navn Falck. Far er da trolig Peder Jørgensen Veien f. 1820 fra Veiholmen, Edøy. Han gifter seg med Johanna 27/9-18757. Dette kan være et bra spor. Fant du noe mer på denne Hans Chr?

yes it may be. He is a illegitimate child. Must follow him to see where he dies. Mothers name is Falck, and among the witnesses from his baptizm ther are more Falck's. Peder came from Veiholmen, Edøy. He being bachelor and she was a spinster, he marry Johanna 27/9-1857. Mother of Hans Chr. was Alet Falck.

 

@Karina Huseby

 

Les postene videre etter Inger Karin's post.....

 

[Karina Huseby]

48 minutter siden, Karina Huseby skrev:

Det er mye mulig...må følge han videre og se hvor han evt dør da? Moren her heter jo Falck, og fadder med navn Falck. Far er da trolig Peder Jørgensen Veien f. 1820 fra Veiholmen, Edøy. Han gifter seg med Johanna 27/9-18757. Dette kan være et bra spor. Fant du noe mer på denne Hans Chr?

yes it may be. He is a illegitimate child. Must follow him to see where he dies. Mothers name is Falck, and among the witnesses from his baptizm ther are more Falck's. Peder came from Veiholmen, Edøy. He being bachelor and she was a spinster, he marry Johanna 27/9-1857. Mother of Hans Chr. was Alet Falck. 

Confirmation 16 aug 1857 nr https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/2287/14576/13

Endret April 15, 2021 av Karina Huseby

[Caroline Falk]

On 4/14/2021 at 2:05 PM, Egil Johannessen said:

Census 1871 - do you have the scanned original? If so, can you determine whether it states Christiansund or Christiansand?

 

England and Wales Census, 1871 - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KDD6-J7G

Name: Christian Falk
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1871
Event Place: Horninglow, Staffordshire, England, United Kingdom
Event Place (Original): Horninglow, Staffordshire, England
Sub-District: Burton Upon Trent
Enumeration District: 25
Sex: Male
Age: 29
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Police Constable
Birth Year (Estimated): 1842
Birthplace: Christiansund, Norway
Relationship to Head of Household: Head
Relationship to Head of Household (Original): Head
Affiliate Image Identifier: GBC/1871/2907/0158

Household    Role    Sex    Age    Birthplace
Christian Falk    Head    M    29    Christiansund, Norway
Elizabeth Falk    Wife    F    27    Bristol St Philip'S, Gloucestershire
Joseph John Falk    Son    M    2    Gloucester, Gloucestershire
Edward Falk    Son    M    0    Gloucester, Gloucestershire

 

 

 

On 4/14/2021 at 3:05 PM, Per.H.Skaug said:

I konfirmasjonen som Egil har funnet og ved fødselen av kandidaten til Inger Karin, står det jo at faren heter Peder, så denne må jo i høyeste grad være interessant!

 

[Caroline Falk]

Hello,

Thankyou for all for the help and interest given to me as I search for the birthplace and Family of my Great Great Grandfather Christian Falk.

I wonder if there is an address or website where I could tell the story that I have got so far, and show all the documents I have collected over the years  I have been researching. Any contact details where I could share the story would be amazing.

kindest regards

Caroline

[Karina Huseby]

Hei 

Christian Pedersen Falck from Astafjord/Gratangen/Ibestad parish in Troms has a son Peder Christiansen Falck born 1819, who marry 1859 to 12 yr younger Ingeborg Anna Hansdt. b. 1831. Can this be his sec wife? What if Peder C Falck had a son Christian Pedersen Falck from previous marriage? Can someone look into this? Troms is far from Kr.sund, but Christian can have moved south?

Astafjord;  https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/327/pv00000006507908 

Old Peder C Falck dies: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/267/pg00000002097384

 

Same person on Boldnæs?? https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/327/pv00000006245588

 

Endret April 18, 2021 av Karina Huseby

[Per.H.Skaug]

Here is Peder Falck at the census in 1875, with wife and son Kristian Fredrik b 1861 in Ibestad. https://www.digitalarkivet.no/census/person/pf01052447007632

 

It is of course still  possible that he may have had a son Christian born in a pervious marriage, but probably not likely to name a second son with the same name if he was still alive.

[Per.H.Skaug]

Here is Peder in a previous marriage in 1855 to Synne Marie Jensdatter https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/327/pv00000006245588

 

She died in or just after childbirth in 1857, but I have not included the links here as they don't seem relevant.

 

Still not impossible that he could have had a previous marriage with a son ending up in Kristiansund, but probably not likely.

Endret April 18, 2021 av Per.H.Skaug

[Karina Huseby]

På 13.4.2021 den 17.51, Frank Marton Pedersen skrev:

Mon tro om det er denne Christian som er vår mann?

 

Denmark, Church Records, 1812-1918 - Ancestry.com

 

 

Er "Nated" i Census 1891 det samme som Nørre eller Nebel?

 

EDIT: Nørre, Nebel må være en feilregistrering. Christian Falk flytter fra Varde til Egvad, se under. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Går det å få slettet funn fra Danmark da de ikke er aktuelle?

[Karina Huseby]

På 13.4.2021 den 13.41, Karina Huseby skrev:

Hei dere.

Får ikke endret overskrift. Er ikke Dorset, men Staffordhire. 

Etter omfattende søk etter Christian Falk på vegne av tippoldebarnet i England, må jeg få be om assistanse. Christian (Kristian) Falk skal være født f. ca juni 1840-41 iflg hans arbeidsdokumenter. Han emigrerer fra Norge til England FØR 1868, da han gifter seg med Elizabeth Biggs (hun dør 1904) i Burton upon Trent, Staffordshire, England. De får sønnene Joseph John f. ca 1869 og Edward f. ca1871. Christian jobber bortimot 20 år som politimann, dog med noe broket oppførsel. På engelske dokumenter oppgis Kristiansund, Norway som hjemsted ved flere anledninger, alternativt er det ment som uthavn kanskje? Jeg finner ingen C F f 1840/41 i Kristiansund, kun en Christian August Falk f. 26/6-1842 død i London 31/10-1905. Det er IKKE den Christian jeg søker. På vielsen 13/6-1868 oppgir han far å være Peter Falk. Christian dør ved påkjørsel av tog ved Branstone Station 20 august 1908, Mer vites ikke. 

 

Jeg må sette min lit til dere her, som et siste forsøk i å finne hans norske familieside. Det er for øvrig den siden som er interessant her. Mulig han selv har gjort det vanskeligst mulig for å kunne bli sporet. All hjelp mottas med stor takk. 

 

Mvh 

Karina  

 

[Egil Johannessen]

På 16.5.2021 den 14.04, Karina Huseby skrev:

Går det å få slettet funn fra Danmark da de ikke er aktuelle?

 

Man får ikke endret innlegg etter 24 timer (se veil. - https://forum.arkivverket.no/announcement/4-hvordan-registrere-seg-og-andre-nyttige-veiledninger-how-to-register-and-other-useful-guides/ )

 

Det er vel heller ingen grunn til å endre noe da @Frank Marton Pedersen klargjorde at dette var feil person i denne posten;

 

Endret Mai 19, 2021 av Egil Johannessen

[Karina Huseby]

Hello

 

DNA sample now shows several matches from Kristiansund and Trondheim, so Christian was most likely born in this area. How or when he got the name Falk is not known.

 

Names related to this is:

Trondheim, Sør-Trøndelag

Tiller, Sør-Trøndelag -family of Petter Olsen Veien born 27 dec 1869. Familyname: Skjettlein.

Eide/Grytten, Møre and Romsdal

Seljevold, Veøy, Møre and Romsdal

Gjemnes, Møre and Romsdal -family of Peder Ellingsen Tostrup born 19 aug 1799 (Lensmann/"sheriff").

Sunndal, Møre and Romsdal

Myrset, Tingvoll, Møre and Romsdal

 

Further help and investigation is needed;-) 

[Anton Hagelee]

8 hours ago, Karina Huseby said:

Gjemnes, Møre and Romsdal -family of Peder Ellingsen Tostrup born 19 aug 1799 (Lensmann/"sheriff").

 

So, I assume that these names you have listed are names of oldest know ancestor of people that have matched the DNA submitted by Caroline Falk?

 

I wonder if the birth year is off on this post. The  Peder Ellingsen Tostrup that pops up on searches for him has him born in 1768. He is listed as a Lensmann in the links. 

 

http://eblix.net/legacy/getperson.php?personID=I4993&tree=1

 

https://slektogdata.no/slektsforum/viewtopic.php?t=137752

 

 

Endret Juli 8, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Anton Hagelee]

8 hours ago, Karina Huseby said:

Tiller, Sør-Trøndelag -family of Petter Olsen Veien born 27 dec 1869. Familyname: Skjettlein.

 

Looks as if Peder was born out of wedlock. Nr. 2. 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070419620035

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/255/pd00000012341944

 

Elen in 1865 FT 

 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/person/pf01038325006980

 

 

 

 

 

Endret Juli 8, 2022 av Anton Hagelee

[Inger Karin Haarbye]

This is difficult, as you can't know which ancestor(s) of the DNA-match are common ancestor. You just have to find common ancestors for several of the DNA-tested matches. I have found this woman (2 of her children), and her brother (Haagen), as ancestors for 3 (very) different matches.  (But this does not make it easier... This would be ab. 9.cousin level, might be to far back in time)

https://www.geni.com/people/Dordi-Hoaas/6000000007209706306

Endret Juli 9, 2022 av Inger Karin Haarbye

[Karina Huseby]

På 8.7.2022 den 23.04, Anton Hagelee skrev:

 

So, I assume that these names you have listed are names of oldest know ancestor of people that have matched the DNA submitted by Caroline Falk?

 

I wonder if the birth year is off on this post. The  Peder Ellingsen Tostrup that pops up on searches for him has him born in 1768. He is listed as a Lensmann in the links. 

 

http://eblix.net/legacy/getperson.php?personID=I4993&tree=1

 

https://slektogdata.no/slektsforum/viewtopic.php?t=137752

 

 

Ja her ble f.dato feil skrevet av meg. Beklager.

[Karina Huseby]

OPPDATERING -CASE CLOSED!

 

Christian Falk is found, albeit with a different name -Iver. If he just kept Iver, like Christian Iver, I guess it would be much easier to find him;-) He probably changed his name the day he boarded a ship bound for England in 1865. He left his parents and 5 siblings behind, never returned or had any further contact. He came from a little place close to Kristiansund city, late Edøy municipality. I was pretty close, breathing his neck so to speak. Without 100% certain sources, I had to search further. Luckily, Caroline, got some help from a good DNA-researcher..and he found him due to her DNA!

 

His Norwegian family side have been researching for tens of years! Out of respect for them and Caroline, I choose not to go into details, not yet anyway. I leave that to Caroline.  

 

Thank you for all your help and guidance. My best advice: NEVER GIVE UP! 

 

Best regards 

Karina 

 

 

[Caroline Falk]

Happy new year!!
On the trail of Christian Falk from Norway!
My brilliant contact in Norway, working on this story for over a year, has been collecting data surrounding my DNA matches and has turned up trumps! A Eureka moment for me after almost 20 years of ancestry research.
So many mistakes I made by following the wrong Christian(without proper varification) in the romantic hope he was the one I was looking for have been disappointing. Leading me to delete from my tree back to Christian marrying his Elizabeth Biggs in 1868.  Along with the entries made in the front of Elizabeths bible, I know from 1868 forward is correct, and I had the right guy because I was able to verify this with Census and certifications, along with newspaper articles and help from other members on the tree that gave me valuable snippets to add to my collection. I reached out to many many matches and now I feel confident to share the findings that would never have been discovered had it not been for the DNA matches, and to the kindest of others who also took the test. I have also uploaded my DNA to Geni. I think you may  be able to see it.  There were a lot of Norwegian entries and matches to me on there. This is what I've found.
Christian Falk was not his real name, it was in fact Iver Einersen. He must have changed his name at the time of becoming a Naturalised British Subject. Quite possibly this was because he had committed a crime or had fathered illegitimate children, also a crime in Norway. He did indeed come from the area of Norway mentioned in later Police service reports and articles.
He was a member of the sea military (Navy) and jumped ship in the UK taking a new name. Christian Falk, was most likely a schoolfriend or neighbours name. He jumped ship The Vogt in Swansea in August 1865. There are lots of documents on the Geni website that can be opened. They are hard to read, but  with help to translate them I am learning more, so will add this to the site.

There is an actual Christian Falk from quite a renowned family in the area so that may be why he chose it. They have their own story.
I have much to learn about him and new searches to make prior to 1868 with the name Iver Einersen. The Norwegian system is very difficult to read, but I have help now which has been amazing.
Iver/Christian has family in Norway and there is a particular lady  who has also taken the test and she has Iver in her tree.
This lady had been researching her ancestry with the help of family members for the last 50years! Always drawing a blank on Iver/Christian at the same time in history that I also drew a blank. She had almost given up on him as had I. Then up pops this DNA idea and thankfully lots of people (if they choose to) all over the world are entering their details. Iver/Christian is the brother to this lady's Great grandmother! She and I have been exchanging out Tree stories and some photos, it has been so wonderful after all these years. What is also remarkable, is that my contact in Norway found out that she lives 10mins from him in Trondheim and he visited her .
The world is not so large after all. 

Definitely dont give up looking!
Kindest regards
Caroline

Endret Januar 18, 2023 av Caroline Falk

[Egil Johannessen]

@Karina Huseby

 

@Caroline Falk

 

Great news - I am delighted for you both 😊