[#46383] Per A. Nermo rømte på ski fra Trysil til Sverige ca.1860-70, em. til USA ca.1893

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Arnold Douglas Nermo (circa 1941)Grandson of Per A. NermoCanadian Soldier (He saw front line duty against Germany; fighting in Scicily and France during WWII, in the Canadian Light Armour Division)Worked as a Logger / Lumberman in British Columbia, after the war.Norwegian / Swede; and proud of it!My Father.

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Pete Nermo, brother of Louis, had one of the first steam engines in the Mt. Nebo region of Saskatchewan. He owned a big custom treshing outfit that used many men and teams to gather stooks from the fields. Once, while he was thrashing, his son George got his hand under the belt as it wound quickly around. George's thumb was unfortunately severed. Pete also hauled freight up North during the long cold winters and had many stories of going through the ice, sometime losing horses and loads when crossing lakes and rivers on the way to Big River, Sask.:compliments of John Dahl

[Gjest Chris Bingefors]

Thanks Arnie for the pictures! We so rarely can put a face to the names we research. I really enjoyed seeing the family.

[Gjest Arnie Patrick Nermo]

And thank you Chris, (and all the rest of the rearchers)!!!! It really has been fun, a treat for me and my relatives. There is a buzz of phone calls, and e-mails and snail-mail, etc. We are busy gathering some more of the stories, too. I will be talking with my aunt Alice soon....so if anyone has some questions, please pass them on to me. Of course I will her ask if Per died content, and the rest of the story about Martha being a Luthern minister. I am still curious about the crime that Per committed in 1889. I e-mailed the state archive at Harnosand. Do I have to write them with an inquiry. Can somebody help from your end?Thanks everyone,Arnie

[Gjest Vanja Persson]

Very nice pictures Arnie!I have a trip to Härnösand planned in April so I can look for the decree then.Ken asked about Victor. It may have been Victor Larsson. He was married with Ella Larsson, a sister to Laura (Louis' wife).I've spent a part of this week sitting by my Mother's side until she passed away. So as you certainly understand I'm not so very busy by the computer for the moment, it's so many other things to do.

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Hi Vanja, I was very saddened at the news of your mother's passing. There is little solice except to say at least you were there with her, to hold her and help her cross over, and I am sure that that had great meaning for her. Life has a way of putting things in perspective for us when we think we are in control. I have been talking with my Aunt Alice yesterday. She is so delighted to talk about the past, now. She lamented that she has no one in the family to speak Swedish with. It would be nice if you gave her a call. (I will e-mail the number to you) She might be able to give you some more details about Algot and Helmer & Ida and Anna (and Hilding). I am still trying to round up some photos and will pass them along to you if they come my way. Aunt Alice said that her grandfather Per A. Nermo died a content & happy man.(#136) He never spoke of missing or returning to Norway, Sweden or Minessota. He was quite a strong, big man, at about 6'4' (190cm.)and ramrod straight. Also, She still strongly contends that Per's sister (1/2 sister?, Martha) was a Luthern Minister, very involved with the church. I suspect that she was in Trysil. Anyone there know???? Alice had never heard of Pete Nermo's Titanic story before but she had one of her own. She met her future husband, Gus Moberg, at M. Nebo , were they went to school. Gus' Parents were booked for the same voyage, but cancelled their tickets, for another ship, because Ms. Moberg had a bad premonition about the Titanic, and refused to go on her. She made a good choice!!!.All the best over there!Arnie P. Nermo

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

I spoke again to Aunt Alice tonight. She recalled Per A Nermo designing and making cross country skis for his grandchildern. She said he could make the best in the whole Mt. Nebo region. He would first cut and shape them; then steam them in a barrel (in fine Trysil tradition), to get the right curves. They all had great fun and there was even a small ski jump nearby.Regards,Arnie

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Wow! I can't believe it! I can't believe we didn't see it there, all this time, in front of our eyes!1889 was the ''Year from Hell'' for Per A. Nermo and family!~ Jan. 12-18 the family moves from Borgsjo to Hedsjo... Why are they doing this, Kasja Lisa is 8.5 months pregnant and it's in the middle of winter?~ Then, 20 days later, Arne Valerius is born, and dies 3 days later, Feb 1.~ Kajsa Lisa dies next, within a few weeks, (brain fever?), Feb. 1889.~ Katarina, a girl of 14, dies Sept 30, re: (#3). Moreover, Chris your entry on (#136) is very revealing. Why does the Vicar not state the cause of death? Was it because Katarina's cause of death was from eating Poison Nightshade berries! (according to family history, accidently?) However, any farm girl worth her salt knows that it's deadly poisonous! I believe it must have been suicide! She obviously was devistated from loosing her mother and little brother a few months earlier.~ Shortly after, Per A. Nermo, angry and despondent about loosing three family members in one year, commits a first time offence of burglery / theft and is convicted on Nov. 25 1889.No wonder the Nermo family packed up and left Sweden for a start in the New World, after Per was parolled, 1889 was a hell of a horrible year to remember! Questions:How far was the journey from Borgsjo to Hedsjo, and would the facilities be better for a birth - was it a forced move in winter?How would the Luthern Vicar treat a young suicide at that time.....any Church restrictions on the burial if it's a suicide? Can anyone take a look for the grave headstone over there?Lastly ,as an aside, Why did the family need migrant / travel papers to move around the country... why was it that restrictive in Sweden, at that time?

[Gjest A. E. Ferner]

I folketellingen 1900 finner vi Pers yngste halvsøster Sofie: Lenke hun og hennes mann tilhører Den Lutherske Frimenighet - det kan jo være hun som var 'Lutheran Minister'?? Og familien hadde tydeligvis bodd i Sverige en del år.

[Gjest A. E. Ferner]

Jeg fant Per Arnesen i Stamrullen for Østerdalske kompani: Lenke

[Gjest Vanja Persson]

Borgsjö is a parish and the family lived in the village Grundsjön there. Hedsjö is a village in the parish Ramsjö. Grundsjön och Hedsjö is just at each side of the border, not far at all.

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Vanja, You were right about Victor. (#180) It was Victor Larsson, the brother of my Grandma Laura. He was chewing tobacco and spitting it out into a spittoon. My brother, Kenneth, being young and innocent at the time, thought Victor was gravely ill and full of black tar.Regards,Arnie

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Did the main Norwegian train company, with a spur line near Trysil, ever employ men as ''bouncers''? (A person that threw / kicked illegal passangers off the boxcars.) Per was a big guy and he was supposed to have done this job as a young man. He might have killed a person doing this and fled to Sweden in 1866.

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Vanja or Chris,What is the translation of (#184 & #185) ?Thanks Arnie

[Gjest Per Nermo]

Regarding Per A. Nermo's sentence in 1889 :As I said in (113) (in Norwegian, I admit), I have already contacted the State Archives at Härnösand (and the State Railways Museum, for that matter !), and I've even received an answer from Härnösand, telling me that they've found the 18 pages 'criminal act' (sentence) in the vault, which they will run through a scanner an mail to me by snail mail. I will then relay it (or an exerpt of it) here in this forum.Mr. Göran Gullbro at the the State Archives at Härnösand confirms our ''guess'' that the expression ''för 1:sta resan'' in the Nov 25th 1889 sentence means that it was the first time that Per A. Nermo was sentenced to jail or hard labour.Regarding his daughter Martha, is seems to be no doubt that she arrived in Canada in 1912 and stayed there (see above). It unclear to me why you maintain that she probably (or possibly) stayed in Trysil.In (184) it is told that according to the 1900 census in Trysil, Per A.'s youngest half sister Sofie at the time was a member of an Lutheran 'free' congregation. Maybe there's a mix-up ?From Järnvägsmuséet (Swedish State Railways Museums) I've received an answer that they have so far been unable to establish whether or not Per A. was employed by SJ.

[Gjest Per Nermo]

The pronoun (?) ''you'' in 4th paragraph above was meant for Arnie.Regarding the theory about the 'suicide' of the 14 year old daughter of Per A. Nermo in 1889, I must say I find it rather far fetched, but then again, of course, possible. In one of the above posting, it's revealed that the church book for the period seems to have been written at a later point in time based on loose paper notes, and that the causes of deaths may have been lost/forgotten in the meantime.

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Re: (#190) Thank you for the research with Harnosand and SJ. .....Per, It is much appreciated.My only good sources at this end are Aunt Alice (92) and my mother (84). Both of them are quite sharp for their ages. According to both of them, Katarina (b.1875) died from eating poison Nightshade berries. My mother was quite surprised to find that Katarina was 14, she always thought she was under 5 years old. From a very young age, as a farm girl in Ontario, my mother was warned never to touch Nightshare. I know it's a stretch, but I can see a young girl quite despondent over the loss of her mother, deciding to give up life. Shortly after, Per A. gets in trouble with the law. As I said in (#183) It was a very tough year for the family.Aunt Alice keeps saying Per A.'s sister Marta was a Luthern minister. Perhaps she is confused with Sophie or Per A.'s daughter Martha who came to Canada in 1912. My Aunt Alice is a very devout Christian and the story has a lot of significance for her. I will try to ask her again what she remembers.Thanks for all the digging!Arnie P. Nermo

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Re: (#190)....... According to (#23) Per A. had a half sister Marthe (who inherrited the Nermo farm in Trysil) His first daughter was named Martha also. I think Aunt Alice is confused as to which was associated with the Church. In her mind, it was a sister.Regards, Arnie

[Gjest Chris Bingefors]

Translation of Norwegian #184I folketellingen 1900 finner vi Pers yngste halvsøster Sofie: Lenke hun og hennes mann tilhører Den Lutherske Frimenighet - det kan jo være hun som var 'Lutheran Minister'?? Og familien hadde tydeligvis bodd i Sverige en del år.In the census of 1900 we find Per´s younger half-sister Sofie: (Link) She and her husband belong to the Lutheran Free Congregation - she could be the Lutheran Minister? And the family evidently had lived in Sweden for some years. (Comment: Only 'free churches' ie non-state churches such as Pentecostals, Methodists etc allowed layman preachers, which is probably what is meant with Lutheran Minister. This was a sore point with the established church and many left for America to be allowed to practice their religion. Until the late 1800s no other churches but the state were allowed in Sweden. It was not until 1950 or 51 that people were allowed to leave the state church without joining another religious organization (in Sweden).#185 says that Per Arnesen is in the muster roll for Österdalske Kompani (military unit).AE Ferner: Det står i lenken du gav att det finns en merknad om flytting för Per Arnesen. Kan man finna den och se vad där står?(Translation: In the military roll there is a note about a comment on Per Arnesen`s moving, is it possible to find out what it says?)Re Nightshade berries: if the legend is true, was she by any chance pregnant or thought she was? That was the most common cause for suicide attempts/poisoning in young girls. We will never know, but it is one likely reason, especially if her mother died and she had no support. Any suspected suicide attempt would have been covered up as much as possible or there would have been an inquest (records of any such event should be available, but there should have been a note somewhere since normal burial was not allowed). Graves in Sweden are not kept forever, only 50 years, unless they are paid for, there will not be any headstone left now.

[Gjest Chris Bingefors]

Re migrant papers:Passports for internal and foreign travel were abolished in 1860. However, anyone moving from one parish to another had to have a certificate from the vicar stating name, birth, confirmation, marriage status and other facts. This had to be shown to the vicar in the parish you moved into, for registration as an inhabitant. Parishes did not want poor people without steady jobs because then they were responsible financially for them. This may be one reason why a lot of people were registered in Borgsjö but actually lived in Hedsjö. The job market was changing rapidly, from farm labour jobs which were always on contract for one year (Nov 1 to Oct 31) to short term employments in the forestry industry. That meant you did not have steady employment according to the law and Hedsjö did not want the responsibility. A fellow researcher with good local knowledge has confirmed this.If you could not show that you were gainfully employed or on your way to a job you had to go to prison. This was more or less strictly enforced.The state church was in charge of civic registration from about 1664 to 1991. We had to have these certificates to move all of that time. Now the IRS (tax authorities) are in charge and you have to report moving to them and they send the papers (computer file) to the appropriate community. The same procedure goes for emigrating to Norway from Sweden. Not the other way around however, coming back to Sweden from Norway I had to go for a personal interview with immigration.

[Gjest Chris Bingefors]

Detta måste vara Pers halvsyster Sofie när hon lämnar Sverige (Per´s half sister leaving Sweden after living there for 10 years:Post 934371Mathisdotter, Sofie Hustru (gift kvinna)f. 18/7 1861 i Trysil, Hedmark fylke, NorgeUtvandrad 28/11 1892 från Vallsjön 1, Lima, Kopparbergs län (Dalarna) till Trysil, Hedmark fylke, NorgeKälla: Husförhörslängd, s. 606Emibas emigrationsakt: Lima W 1892 033Onormerade namnformer:Födelseland: Norge Destinationsland: NorgeHusband Gjermundsen, Martinus and 6 children born between 1883 och 1891 in Lima, Dalarna province, Sweden.The household census says that they were married in a civil cermony 12 June 1882, not by the state church, which indicates that they were 'free church'. Husband has not had Confirmation in church. There is also a note about the christening of one of the children, the books are not filmed but are in the archives here in Uppsala.

[Gjest Bjørn Olav Åsvold]

To 196: Yes, this is Per's half sister. The family of Sofies husband Martinus Gjermundsen Næsbakken were not members of the state church, but instead members of 'Trysil Frimenighet'. Their church book (scannet kirkebok, Dissenterprotokoll for Trysil Frimenighet 1892-1928) tells that Martinus and Sofie and their 6 children moved to Næsbakken, Trysil on 15 Nov 1892 after having stayed in Lima, Sweden for the last years.

[Gjest Arnie P. Nermo]

Chris, Thank you for the erudite anallysis and explanations in (#194 & #195)I had not considered that Katarina might have been pregnant, I will ask my sources here!!! I spoke further on this topic with my mother and upon reflection she was able to recall that Ewin Arne Nermo, son of Pete, had ''also'' voice suspicions that Katerina had committed suicide by eating Nightshade.

[Gjest A. E. Ferner]

Also sister of Sofie, Oline, was obviously member of 'Trysil Frimenighet'; she was married to Ener Gjermundsen Nesbakken 25 January 1882 in a civil ceremony (Dissenterprotokoll for Trysil Frimenighet 1892 - 1928).Chris: Antagelig befinner Stamrullen seg på Statsarkivet på Hamar; jeg skal undersøke nærmere.Anne Elise

[Gjest Chris Bingefors]

Så var Oline och Sofie gifta med två bröder?(Were Oline and Sofie married to two brothers?)Intressant att se om dt står något mer om Per Nermos flykt i stamrullan. Hoppas du finner den i Hamar.