Johan Carl Palmstrom Death Certificate

[Ann-Mary Engum]

2 minutter siden, Mark Peterson skrev:

 

 

 

Hi Egil. Stupid question, maybe, but could there of been 2 people from Arendal area of Norway that were born around 1826-1833 named Johan Carl (Pedersen) Palmstrom and ONLY 1 of them died in December 1855, as you found and the other one did go to USA and then onto Australia. Thx Mark Peterson

 

No. 

[Mark Peterson]

18 hours ago, Ann-Mary Engum said:

 

No. 

Ok, thx Ann-Mary Engum. Is that because there was only 1 person in those years ( 1826-1834 ), that was named Johan Carl Pedersen, therefore only 1 JCP dying in December 1855? Thx again Mark Peterson

Endret September 17, 2019 av Mark Peterson

[Mark Peterson]

On 9/16/2019 at 8:24 PM, Ann-Mary Engum said:

 

No. 

Hi Ann-Mary Engum. So, there was only 1 JCP in areas around and in Arendal, Norway, that were born between 1826-1834? Is that correct? Thx Mark Peterson

Endret September 18, 2019 av Mark Peterson

[Ann-Mary Engum]

3 minutter siden, Mark Peterson skrev:

Hi Ann-Mary Engum. So, there was only 1 JCP in areas around and in Arendal, Norway, that were born between 1826-1834? Is that correct? Thx Mark Peterson

Yes

[Mark Peterson]

Just now, Ann-Mary Engum said:

Yes

 

Ok thx again. Mark Peterson 

[Mark Peterson]

if you were born in the Arendal area of Norway during the Treaty of Kiel, 4 November 1814 - 7 June 1905, would you still be known at birth as a Norwegian or a Swede? It’s just that I can only find a Carl Peterson, Born in 1833 in Sweden going to New York in 1853. Which would make his age correct of 23 in 1856 on the ships passenger list to Melbourne, Australia. Thx Mark Peterson

Endret September 18, 2019 av Mark Peterson

[Ivar S. Ertesvåg]

4 timer siden, Mark Peterson skrev:

if you were born in the Arendal area of Norway during the Treaty of Kiel, 4 November 1814 - 7 June 1905, would you still be known at birth as a Norwegian or a Swede?

Norwegian, of course.  Norway was a kingdom on its own, with a national assembly, jurisdiction, church, armed forces, currency, etc. The union with Sweden was

personal; i.e. the king of Sweden should also be the king of Norway.

[Mark Peterson]

5 hours ago, Ivar S. Ertesvåg said:

Norwegian, of course.  Norway was a kingdom on its own, with a national assembly, jurisdiction, church, armed forces, currency, etc. The union with Sweden was

personal; i.e. the king of Sweden should also be the king of Norway.

 

Ok thx. I was pretty sure, but just wanted to make sure 100%, thx Mark Peterson.

[Mark Peterson]

I saw this a while ago on Norway-Heritage site, so that’s why I asked the question about being a Swede or a Norwegian during 1814-1905. thx Mark Peterson.

 

One of the dirty little secrets about passenger lists is they were required to file the list of passenger names at their first port of call, not necessarily the port your target may have disembarked at. And for 1814-1905, Norway and Sweden shared a monarch which sometimes allowed a mixing of records on nationality. And a number of vessels actually did depart from Sweden picking up passengers on the way.

 

 

Endret September 20, 2019 av Mark Peterson
Extra info

[Mark Peterson]

So maybe this could be my Charles Peterson, but listed as from Sweden, instead of Norway. Thx Mark Peterson.

 

Also, Boston is only about 3 hrs away by car nowadays to Troy, Rensselaer, New York, where Ellen Cavanagh worked as a servant and if it’s the correct Carl ( Charles ) Peterson, Troy is where they got married in August 1855.

 

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCHN-SWK

 

Name Carl J Peterson
Event Type Immigration
Event Date 1853
Event Place Boston, Suffolk, Massachusetts, United States
Gender Male
Age 24
Nationality Sweden
Birth Year (Estimated) 1829
Birth Country Sweden
Ship Name Lexington
Page 2245
Citing this Record

"Massachusetts, Boston Passenger Lists, 1820-1891," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCHN-SWK : 12 March 2018), Carl J Peterson, 1853; citing p. 2245, Ship Lexington, NARA microfilm publication M277 (Washington D.C.: National Archives and Records Administration, n.d.), roll 045; FHL microfilm 419,939.

Endret September 20, 2019 av Mark Peterson
Extra I fo

[Ivar S. Ertesvåg]

På 20.9.2019 den 8.09, Mark Peterson skrev:

I saw this a while ago on Norway-Heritage site, so that’s why I asked the question about being a Swede or a Norwegian during 1814-1905. thx Mark Peterson.

 

One of the dirty little secrets about passenger lists is they were required to file the list of passenger names at their first port of call, not necessarily the port your target may have disembarked at. And for 1814-1905, Norway and Sweden shared a monarch which sometimes allowed a mixing of records on nationality. And a number of vessels actually did depart from Sweden picking up passengers on the way.

 

The cited passage is somewhat confusing.

 I suppose that the list filing requirement refers to USA authorities. What it  - litterally - says, is that a ship sailing, say, from Göteborg(Sweden), via Arendal (Norw), Southhampton (UK), Portland (Maine, US) to New York, should file passenger lists as of arriving Arendal. This does not make sense.  What could make sense is that it should file passenger lists (to US authorities) as of the first US port of call; that is, Portland rather than New York. Then the immigration authorities would capture any passengers disembarking anywhere in USA.

This  influences the registration of where they arrived (New York immigrants registered as arriving in Portland, Maine; to keep future familiy historians buzy) - but it does not make sense to say that it affects the registration of their origin (Portland?).

What the citation also indicate is that all the Norwegians etc. that went on a ship to England, changed to another ship sailing from England to USA, were registered as English. This does not make much sense either. But if right, it is more likely that your Charles is registered as "English"/"British" than "Swedish".

[Mark Peterson]

1 hour ago, Ivar S. Ertesvåg said:

 

The cited passage is somewhat confusing.

 I suppose that the list filing requirement refers to USA authorities. What it  - litterally - says, is that a ship sailing, say, from Göteborg(Sweden), via Arendal (Norw), Southhampton (UK), Portland (Maine, US) to New York, should file passenger lists as of arriving Arendal. This does not make sense.  What could make sense is that it should file passenger lists (to US authorities) as of the first US port of call; that is, Portland rather than New York. Then the immigration authorities would capture any passengers disembarking anywhere in USA.

This  influences the registration of where they arrived (New York immigrants registered as arriving in Portland, Maine; to keep future familiy historians buzy) - but it does not make sense to say that it affects the registration of their origin (Portland?).

What the citation also indicate is that all the Norwegians etc. that went on a ship to England, changed to another ship sailing from England to USA, were registered as English. This does not make much sense either. But if right, it is more likely that your Charles is registered as "English"/"British" than "Swedish".

Ok thx Ivar S. Ertesvag, I think. So I should be looking for a Charles or Carl Petterson or Peterson being listed as English / British, instead of Norwegian or Swedish then. Thx Mark Peterson

[Ivar S. Ertesvåg]

12 minutter siden, Mark Peterson skrev:

Ok thx Ivar S. Ertesvag, I think. So I should be looking for a Charles or Carl Petterson or Peterson being listed as English / British, instead of Norwegian or Swedish then. Thx Mark Peterson

well.... your choice...  If he was Norwegian you should primarily look for a Norwegian.

However _if_ the registration of him was wrong, the there is a multitude of possibilities.

My point here (#161) was that the cited passage does not make sense.

[Mark Peterson]

10 hours ago, Ivar S. Ertesvåg said:

well.... your choice...  If he was Norwegian you should primarily look for a Norwegian.

However _if_ the registration of him was wrong, the there is a multitude of possibilities.

My point here (#161) was that the cited passage does not make sense.

Ok then. It’s just that I and other helpful people on this site and others, have had no luck for a Carl Charles Petterson Peterson being on a ship as a Norwegian or being born from about 1826-1834, around Aust-Agder area or close to Arendal, Norway. So, I might just try and search for a Charles Petterson on a ship from Norway to maybe UK and then onto Boston or New York, USA from about 1846 -1854. Thx Mark Peterson

Endret September 21, 2019 av Mark Peterson