Help with my grandfather's lineage

[Peggy Stanley]

I believe I found Mogens father. When you look at the birth record for Mogen his father's farm name looks like Kolien but in fact its probably Rolien. When this Christopher Nielsen married Gjiertrud Pedersdatter 14 Nov 1799 Leksvik his name is shown as Corporal Christopher Nielsen Rolien. He died 17 April 1841.

 

http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=10&filnamn=f18011718&gardpostnr=8&personpostnr=86&merk=86#ovre

 

Yes the church records for Leksvik are in Nord Trondelag. I can post them if you wish?

Ron

 

Thank you, Ron! That must be him. I'm busy getting all of this great information entered on my Ancestry page. I would really love to have the links, if you have time to post them! I try to always include some type of documentation with my entries so other people researching can see that it is accurate. Not everyone does that and there is a lot of inaccurate information.

 

My family will be thrilled with all of this information! Thank you!

[bergiverson]

In the record of Christopher Nielsens marriage ( bottom right side ) there seems to be

a record of Mogens birth to Ingebor Mogensdr. Maybe someone can translate the record to

English?

 

Kildeinformasjon: Nord-Trøndelag fylke, Leksvik, Ministerialbok nr. 701A04 (1783-1816), Trolovede 1799, Ekteviede 1799, side 13.

Permanent sidelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=16388&idx_id=16388&uid=ny&idx_side=-16

Permanent bildelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20070925670560.jpg

[bergiverson]

Peggy you were asking how to copy the records? If you open the link,right click on the record and click Save picture.You can also enlarge the record to 100% but the picture will be larger than your screen?

[Peggy Stanley]

Peggy you were asking how to copy the records? If you open the link,right click on the record and click Save picture.You can also enlarge the record to 100% but the picture will be larger than your screen?

 

 

Yes, that's how I do it or hit the "Print Screen" button and then paste it into publisher where I can highlight the names and add notes and then save as a jpg file. I think I was looking in the right books, but in these older ones, where nothing is divided into columns, (and not knowing the language) I just couldn't figure out what it was saying. :( I really appreciate the links! With that, and you telling me where it is on the page, then I can see what to highlight.

 

Thank again, Ron! You've been a really big help!

[Eline Johansen]

Maybe someone can translate the record to English? Permanent sidelenke: http://www.arkivverk...ny&idx_side=-16

 

I think you should raise that question in the 'Tyding av skannede kilder' (Interpretation of scanned sources) phorum. There are many helpful people there.

 

As for copying of the source material, the PDF buttons on top of the page can be useful if you know how to work with PDF files.

[Peggy Stanley]

In the record of Christopher Nielsens marriage ( bottom right side ) there seems to be

a record of Mogens birth to Ingebor Mogensdr. Maybe someone can translate the record to

English?

 

Kildeinformasjon: Nord-Trøndelag fylke, Leksvik, Ministerialbok nr. 701A04 (1783-1816), Trolovede 1799, Ekteviede 1799, side 13.

Permanent sidelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=16388&idx_id=16388&uid=ny&idx_side=-16

Permanent bildelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20070925670560.jpg

 

Yes, I definitely see Ingebor's name in there twice and it looks like Mogens' birthdate of 1 May 1798. I would love to have a translation of this! :)

[Leif Biberg Kristensen]

Here's the transcript:

 

November 14de ægteviede ved hovedkirken Ungkarl og reformee Corporal Christopher Nielsen Rolien og Pige Giertrud Pedersdatter Tetlien. Spons: Ole Hansen Bierken og Niels Johansen Killingberg.

 

NB: 2e dage forinden dette Ægteskab blev fuldbyrdet, og 3de uger efter sidste offentlige Tillysning af Predikestolen, ankom Ole Melhuus tillige med Hans Rosvold og Ole Rosvold, den første for i disse trende Mænds nærværelse, paa sin Stifdatter Ingebor Mogensdatters vegne, som af Brudgommen har været besvangret, at giøre forbud paa dette hans forestaaende Ægteskab, men da Ingebor Mogensdatters paatale mod Christopher Nielsen Rolien nu alleneste haver været fremført for forligelses kommisionen d. 1 Mai 1798, men og dessuten strax efter, nu for 1½ aar siden, af de samme Mænd giort et ligesaadant forbud mod dette allerede den gang, formældete Ægteskab, uden at Sagen i nogen henseende er bleven viidere lovligen paa-anket, saa kunne ei heller det sidste forbud ansees gieldende efter Loven, eller derfore giøres nogen Opsættelse i den allerede saa nær forestaaende og bekiente forretning.

[Leif Biberg Kristensen]

There's a lot of legal talk here, and I'm not good at legal English.

 

2 days before the marriage, and 3 weeks after the last announcement from the pulpit, Ole Melhuus arrived along with Hans Rosvold and Ole Rosvold, the first for in these three men's proximity at his step-daughter Ingebor Mogensdatter's behalf, who by the groom has been made pregnant, to object to this approaching marriage, but as Ingebor Mogensdatter's accusation against Christopher Nielsen Rolien now only has been stated before the conciliation commission 1 May 1798, but also immediately afterwards, 1½ years ago, by the same men made a similar objection already at that time announced marriage, but as the case has not been legally appealed further, could the last objection not be considered legally valid, nor could there be any delay in the already approaching and announced transaction.

[Eline Johansen]

I can't translate old Norwegian in the way Leif trancibed it. But I may be able to give a short summary in modern English. I hope my rephrasing is correct.

 

Christopher Nielsen Rolien is the groom in the marriage record. Shortly before the marriage (2 days) Ole Melhus, together with two men, arrives at the vicar and claims that the marriage cermony cannot be carried out because Christoper Nilsen had earlier made Ole's stepdaughter Ingeborg Mogensdatter pregnant (presumably some years ago). The vicar points out that this claim also was brought to the conciliation board 1 May 1798. Apparantly, the decision in the conciliation board was to their disfavor (the Norwegian transciption is not clear to me, here), and they had not put forward any appeal, so the vicar writes he cannot take this claim into consideration.

 

Postnote: I didn't see Leif's translation before I answered.

[Leif Biberg Kristensen]

That's great, Eline! You made much more sense of it than I could manage :)

[Peggy Stanley]

Leif and Eline, thank you so much for translating that - and Ron for finding it! To be able to discover that story, that took place over 200 years ago, is amazing! This side of my family is turning out to be pretty interesting. (And I'm still laughing over the "weak in the head" comment on my grandfather's confirmation!)

 

I can't thank you all enough!!! I have traced my mother's side of the family back to nearly the 1500s, but was really not getting very far with my dad's side until I came here. Very cool! Tusen Takk!!!

[bergiverson]

Thanks Leif & Eline for the translation. I have come across these notations in church records before.At least the prest keeps a record of uekte children in the poblic record.Whether there was a civil account its hard to say. I know sometimes a father was assessed a penalty by the civil court if they established who the father was. But as it was said, many times the father used a different name and occupation to avoid legal responsibilty.And too often the child was raised by his grandparents and the mother moved away.I have 2 such cases in my own family.Times were hard on the farms in the 1800s but the children were mainly looked after.