Military Records

[Murray Rystead]

Good Evening,

It has been brought to my attention that for the past several hundred years all norwegian men have at some point served in the army.
With the help of the people from the www.arkivverket.no my great grandfather's records have been found (Olav Knutsson Rysstad born: 1877)

My lineage goes back to 1500s. I've been curious to know what rank or role my ancestors would have had.

My question is the following .....    https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/db/contents/32845     would this be the correct place to be looking?
My ancestors all seemed to live in the Setesdal area (Rysstad, Helle, Uppstad, Nomeland). So would it make sense for them to have been a part of the Vesterlenske infaneriregiment?

Just curious if the following great grandfathers would be on the army lists listed in the link i provided above.
Most men would have served between the ages 19-22?

Knut Tarjeisson Helle -  born: 1827
Tarjei Knutsson Uppstad - born: 1781
Knut Tarjeisson Uppstad - born: 1745
Tarjei Svenkesson Uppstad - born: 1704
Svenke Olsson Nomeland - born: 1670-1678  (exact date unknown)
Olav Knutsson Nomeland - born: 1644
Knut Nilsson Nomeland - born: 1600
Nils Mikkelsson - born: 1570

Thanks for your help

 

[Jon Erik Berg-Hansen]

You could probably start looking here, but waiting for a more specific answer to your question will undoubtedly save you time!

 

[Jon Erik Berg-Hansen]

Akkurat nå, Jon Erik Berg-Hansen skrev:

You could probably start looking here, but waiting for a more specific answer to your question will undoubtedly save you time!

 

https://media.digitalarkivet.no/db/contents/51496

[Jan Weberg]

Vesterlenske regiment is correct.

Here's a link of 19 sources to that regiment:

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/search/sources?s=vesterlenske&from=&to=&format=all&archive_key=

 

The next question will be how to find the area Setesdalen?

https://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raabyggelaget#/media/Fil:Raabygdelagets-fogderi.jpg

 

Setesdalen was a part of "Raabyggelaget Fogderi" in Aust Agder County. And in Vesterlenske Regiment, Råbyggelaget was a company name. For some periods Vesterlenske Regiment was divided in two regiments; 1. (eastern) Vesterlenske and 2. (western) Vesterlenske. To find out which of this regiments Råbyggelaget (with Setesdalen) belonged to, we need your link:

Scroll down your list and open the period 1769 - 1775: 

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/ru10071210040040

You have to blow it up a lot to bee able to read it. The company names are marked in red. You will find out that Råbyggelaget belongs to 1. (Østre) Vesterlenske Regiment. But in this period not only the regiment was divided, but also the company Råbyggelaget was divided in "first" and "second" companies. You will have to check out both. In other periods you may find out that some lists are missing the company name, and only got the names of the company commanders. Then you'll need your list again to find out who was the commander of "your company" at the period you are working with.

 

PS

It's not correct that all young men was soldiers. A group of farms called "soldat legd" had to equip a soldier. But the group of farms who stood back a soldier varied from time to time. It depended of the armies need for soldiers, and most important, "the money chest" to the Danish kings, which seems rather empty most of the time.

 

Anyway, have a good hunt!

 

mvh jan w

Endret Oktober 27, 2020 av Jan Weberg

[Murray Rystead]

Thank you for all your help 🙂 

I started to search in those links sent.....

i found this one  .... but i can't tell what the last name says? Or what all the writing says to the right of the name.

 

[Murray Rystead]

This one too

[Gunnar Sigdestad]

I'm just curious about what info was found on your grandfather?

[Murray Rystead]

My great grandfather's records basically told us that he was in the Linjen (regular army) was a private, had his soldier/service # ...... and i think the year he joined. The company was mentioned and also the same for his younger brother and his two older brothers as well. Basically what i copied and pasted up above. Similar outline only a little over 100 years later. 
There may be more information, but i would have to dig deeper. Since the two Olav brothers were not in a war, i'm sure there wasn't much to record. My grandpa actually served in World War 2 with the Canadian Army, i'm waiting to get more records of what he did during the war. That should be a good chunk of info. 

 

The copy and pasted info up above i was hoping was the record of Knut Tarjeisson Uppstad - born: 1745 

I can't really understand or read norwegian too well let alone the handwriting for alot of these records. Makes it more of a challenge.

[Murray Rystead]

[Jan Weberg]

Hello Murray!

Nr 1: Knud Tarjesen Graamandshuus (a farm in Valle)

Nr 2: KnudTargiersen Løwland ( there's no farm with this name, but I think it's written incorrect for the farm of Løyland in Valle)

 

So to the writing on the right side of the name, first in Norwegian, then in English (this are from your clip 2. The text are a little different but means the same):

Column 1: Alder = age - Column 2: høyde æfter Sjællandske tommer paa bare fødder = height in Danish inches whitout shoes - Column 3: Annoteret til Grenader = when enrolled as Grenader - Column 4: hvor længe tient udi alt = for how long served in total

 

Danish inches in metric measurements: 1 inch was 2,62 cm (one English inch "only" 2,54 cm) So this means that:

Nr 1 Knud was 170 cm high.

Nr 2 Knud was 173 cm high

 

mvh jan w

[Murray Rystead]

thanks Jan for the translation 🙂 
So chances are this isn't my great great grandpa Knut .... not sure which farm is lived in. 

[Murray Rystead]

[Murray Rystead]

Here is Knut Tarjeisson Uppstad's info from the Valle Kommune book. I see something that mentions Loyland?!

[Jan Weberg]

First: I forgot one column. That one who comes after the Danish inches. It says married or not. Both "Knuds" was "not" So I believe that one of them might have been your forefather. They was both bachelors and probably didn't have an own farm yet. So maybe they worked on this farms or that one or both farms didn't have a useful young man to became a soldier. Then they had to get a man from another farm. This happens all the time. For example Nr 1 Knud; it's not for sure that he really lived on the farm "Graamandshuus". But represented the farm as their soldier. The age of both "Knuds" are not that wrong.

 

mvh jan w

[Murray Rystead]

Oh wow interesting.
So if one of these two Knud's is my forefather , then his role would have been an infantry/grenadier?

I found this also in the Valle Kommune .....
Not sure if this helps identify Knut's position in town or where he lived.


"1777 var aret han maeskifte bort bruket sitt til Knut Bjorgulvsson Tveiten. Knut (som ein jan sja om under Tveiti, bnr. 3) gav i 1781 skoyte til Knut Tarjeisson Uppstad. Knut Tarjeisson og huslyden er omroda under Oppstad bnr. 1"

 

[Jan Weberg]

50 minutter siden, Murray Rystead skrev:

It says that Tore Hallvardsdotter who married Knut Tarjeisson Uppstad had lived in Ljoså valley under the farms Løyland and Dale.

[Murray Rystead]

So it could be the second Knud 🙂 because of the Loyland connection

[Jan Weberg]

Hello again!

I have had a closer look at Knud Nr 1 and 2:

In your clip (1769) Knud Nr 1 was said to be 27 years old = born 1742

in your clip (1770) Knud Nr 2 was said to be 23 years old = born 1747

 

In 1762 it came a new extra tax for everyone, except children younger than 12 years (they where "tax free") so let us take a look at the farms Løyland, Graamandshus and Upstad:

1 Løyland:

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/rk10051110260041

Farm nr 26 (here written "Løeland" 3 farmers (column  3 from left) no one with first name Tarjei or similar. No person at all named "Knud"

 

2 Graamandshus:

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/rk10051110260048

Farm nr 45. 2 farmers. The second one "Osmund with wife Birgitte, has a man named "Knud" in column 8. Her was people living in the farmhouse; related to the farmer in some way (not the farmers children), or just a person who rented a room. This may bee Knud nr 1.

 

3 Upstad:

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/rk10051110260053

Farm nr 60. 5(!) farmers. Farmer nr 2 Targij with wife Sigri. Column 4: Children. Torjus, Knud and Ingeborg. Your folks. 

 

PS

Knut's future wife, Tore Halvardsdotter, born around 1757 won't be in the list, cause she was "tax free" (lucky her)

 

According to the stated age of Knud 1 and 2 in the military lists, I checked out the church books between 1740 and 1748 for the combination Knud + Tarjei (or similar) 

The result of baptized "Knuds" with a father "Tarjei" (or similar) for this 9 years was 3.

 

1. Bapt. 17.jan 1740: Knud - Father Torgus Nomeland - Mother Gunil Knudsd. (topcolumn 4 from left)

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070628660024

 

2. Bapt. 26.feb 1741: Knud - Father Torgus Nomeland - Mother Gunil Knudsd. (4 from top column 1)

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070628660027

 

3. Bapt. 22.aug 1745: Knud - Father Targe Svenchesson Upstad - Mother Sigri Gu(n)rousd. (bottom coloumn 3)

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070628660038

 

To me, Knud nr 2 seems to be a good candidate to be your man.

 

mvh jan w

[Jan Weberg]

This is a little bit out of line: Olav Knutsen Nomeland

 

Dated 23.mar 1666, Nomeland, Hylestad parish

Knud Nomeland had 3 sons (at home) 

Ole Knudsson 11 years

Asbiørn Knudsson 8 years

Niels Knudson 4 years

There's no doubt that his age are written 11 and not 22. So it seems he was born around 1655 and not 1644. But still old enough so his son Svenke could have been born whit in the range  1770-1778. (according to this, Olav was 23 in 1778)

 

Just for the record; Here we have Knud Nomeland with full name (1661) He own and used 35,5 % of the farm.

 

mvh jan w

Endret Oktober 29, 2020 av Jan Weberg

[Murray Rystead]

wow lots of information, thank you for your time looking into all of this for me.

So do you think these are for sure the same people? 

The Valle kommune books may be incorrect then?

 

 

 

 

 

[Murray Rystead]

I don't know what   " f. ca. " mean maybe it's a rough estimation?
it's a shame the bumerkets are not shown in the records you showed me.
I'm still amazed how records this far back exist. 

[Jan Weberg]

Are you confused Murray? "f.ca" means "born around"

In your clip above (to the right) under Knud Nilsson Nomeland:

Childs, at least

1. Olav "born around" 1744

2. Anne "n." (mentioned) 1706....and so on

3. Asbjørn "born around" 1658 (8 years) lived in 1666 (taken from the clip I put in above)

4. Nils "born around" 1662 (4 years) lived in 1666 ( taken from my clip)

 

Here are the link to my clip from 1666: You'll find Nomeland on the right page (second from the top) Move to the left page and scroll down from the top to the second farm. This farmer, named "Ole" has a son named Arve Olsson he is 14 years old, not 24. The number "1" are written in the same way.

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/ft10041005140089

 

This list are not a cencus but was made for military use. The history was that the authorities wanted to know how many men there where in Norway who could be used in the army. The first list, from 1664 shall contain farmers from 50 years and younger and sons an others from 12 years an older. If Knud Nomelands son Ole/Olav had been born in 1644, he would have been 20 years in 1664, an should have been in the list, but he isn't. (Nomeland at top, right page)

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/ft10041005140075

Knud Nilsson is also missing, and the reason? He was "to old". And his son Ole/Olav? He was "to young".

 

mvh jan w

[Murray Rystead]

this makes more sense.
thank you for sharing ......   i appreciate your help. 

I have one last question.

I've found his baptism and marriage and death, and i think his birth.
But anything else about his military service?


 

[Jan Weberg]

If Knut Tarjeisson Helle was born 1827, we can assume that he eventually was enrolled around 1847.

In the period 1834 to 1866 he would have been in, what was now called "Christiansandske Infanteribrigade". Unfortunately, there's no digitized records from this period. But of course, that doesn't means that military records don't exist. I believe that you can try to contact "Arkivverket" and ask for help. Sorry Murray!

 

mvh jan w

[Murray Rystead]

I reached out to them awhile back and they couldn't find anything.

It's okay, like i said in my previous message, you have been very helpful.

Thank you so much